Mk1 Tdi Galaxy Will Not Start !

[metaljim]

Anyone got any idea why my tdi will only start with easystart !!!

[seatkid]

Could be several reasons, but first refrain from using eazistart! It will damage your engine that only an expensive rebuild can fix!!

 

Is this a problem that suddenly appeared or has it been getting worse over a period?

 

Do you have a good battery and starter motor? i.e. healthly terminal voltage, fast turn over etc

 

Has the car been serviced recently and when was the fuel filter last changed?

 

Are there any bleeps coming from the dash, before, during or after an attempted start?

 

Try and describe some symptoms (no eazistart!!)

 

Does it restart ok immediately after engine has stopped?

 

Does it start ok when engine is warm/hot after it has stood for a few minutes?

 

Is it just a cold start problem?

 

Does it throw out white smoke when trying to start?

 

Does it even attempt to start?

 

Once running, does it run ok? i.e. smooth, not lumpy, no smoke, pull well, good power, good fuel economy?

[metaljim]

Hi thanks for getting back, its an ongoing thing since the begining of winter,up until then it started on the flip of the key and was perfect,through the winter up until now it did seem to take longer everytime to get started close to getting a flat battery,and when it did start how embarassing it was,could not see the galaxy for white smoke lol,i did find back in the winter that i had no power getting to the glow plugs,and left that as because of the weather and a mechanic told me it would start without them as at the time he could not find out what was wrong with it when he had a quick look for us,at that time when started it would run perfect all day,could turn of engine for three or four hours and still started fine,to get it to start in the morning was a different story,been of the road a couple of weeks now as it would not start at all,with just the odd time it tried to fire up, i have since checked the timing,and before i put it all back together,the engine mounts, pipes and the other bits and pieces,i thought i would try and start it, wher upon it started a couple of times with no trouble,put it all back together and would not start again,untill a friend came and said to try easystart where a quick burst of it and it started strait away,went for a run and drove fine for a good thirty miles,but did notice the longer you left the engine turned of the harder it would take to start,give it an hour standing and it would not start,!!will take your advise and will not use that easystart again!! did only use it twice...have seen large bubbles in the clear pipe, so i got gallon can of diesel and a hand pump and connected pipe to the clear pipe to by past the fillter and pipe and things but still no joy,had all the relays out and changed a couple of them,the ones that most people go on about ie 109 and 103 did not change them with new ones,had the tops of most of them as well and all looked fine,all fuses seem ok,have read somewhere about brake lights causing trouble,starting,my high vision light is not working,and when i had a quick look at the wireing which goes to the light it has been bodged up before and i did not botherd with it at the time as it looked a pig to get at.....seviced the car this time last year....hope you can under stand all this thanks John.

[BrianH]

"i did find back in the winter that i had no power getting to the glow plugs,and left that as because of the weather and a mechanic told me it would start without them as at the time he could not find out what was wrong with it when he had a quick look for us,at that time when started it would run perfect all day,could turn of engine for three or four hours and still started fine"

 

Thats fairly typical of glowplugs that are starting to go or that some have failed, and this will get a lot worse as the weather gets colder. If you have no power theres usually a relay hidden somewhere in the engine (i don't have the diesel version so don't know where) which will switch them on. If your getting nothing at the busbar to prove the point firstly i'd try touching a thick cable between the busbar and the positive on the battery for a few seconds, then try starting as normal. If it starts you then know what the cause of your poor starting actually is and then can start trying to locate it. Which model is it?

[metaljim]

Hi, just to say i changed the glow plugs begining of winter,and its a ( mk1 1999 ) will have ago at what you say,....thanks.

[seatkid]

Does the glowplug light stay on for more than a fraction of second when cold starting?

 

If not - it may be a faulty temperature sensor - the one fitted in the top radiator hose, I think. (Its a dual device fitted on Mk1 Tdi one serves the water gauge, the other tells the ECU the temperature and is used for glow plug timing, fuelling and injection timing change with temperature)

 

VAGCOM/VCDS may be able to help by checking the reported temperature - perhaps someone can comment on that.

[BrianH]

Won't help changing them if they aren't getting any power in the first place though? there will be some sort of controlling relay it could well be that that has failed. All you would be doing by what i suggested is bypassing the relay to see if that is your issue (I could see it could be a fuel issue as well but since you mention the glowplugs it makes sense to try and rule them out).

 

if the plugs weren't really needed at least some of the time VW wouldn't have put them on there. Some diesels don't need them (direct injection usually) but this one obviously does.

 

One word of warning - use a decently sized cable (fused if you can would be best) as they will draw a fairly high amount of current, and don't keep them on there more than a few seconds.

[seatkid]

 

One word of warning - use a decently sized cable (fused if you can would be best) as they will draw a fairly high amount of current, and don't keep them on there more than a few seconds.

 

Not recommended, they take up to 160 amps initially! The chances of accidently shorting the battery to ground are very high and then you would be sorry.

 

A diagnostic scan with VAGCOM/VCDS is the first thing to do. As I pointed out, a faulty temperature sensor will affect glowplug power and timing, and also fuel quantity and injection timing. (MJ mentioned clouds of white smoke on starting, which is a classic timing issue)

 

Lack of glowplug operation should only make starting as difficult as described in sub zero temperatures.

[metaljim]

Hi Seatkid, the glow plug light does stay on for more than a few seconds and have already fitted a new temperature sensor,that was one of the things i changed not long ago because i was having trouble with limp mode,also changed another sensor and changed most of the vacuum pipes,nearly gave up on that,but it turned out to be the vacuum pipe coming up from the back of the engine...

[metaljim]

Forgot to mention, is there any more relays and fuses that could be under the bonnet on a mk1,as i cannot find any...

[seatkid]

Check the glowplug circuit

 

F32 - 3 amp - this feeds the coil of the Glowplug Relay

 

F74 - 60 amp - this feeds the Glowplug Relay main contacts

 

K70 - is the Glowplug Relay

 

All in the fusebox under the drivers dash (F32 first level, F74,K70 on 3rd level I think) see below

 

[metaljim]

Will have alook tomorrow seatkid and let you know how i get on,thanks again.

[metaljim]

Just to say i found that the 3amp fuse was missing lol,put one back in there and have got power to glow plugs,now it is continually trying to fire up but will not run,there is a clicking sound coming from around the pump area,must be the solenoild i suppose.  (get one thing going and you get another)   did notice after giving it a run the other day where it drove perfect untill we stop for a good hour and then would not start again,untill i gave it a second shot of easystart,we where only about 1/2 a mile away from home then,but was woundering if we where going to get home as there was a couple of times it trying to cut out.

[seatkid]

First just check your battery is holding up now that glowplugs are working - i.e. the voltage isnt plumetting during starts.

 

I would concentrate on  two areas:

 

1. You mentioned large air bubbles in the fuel line - whats the history of the fuel filter (i.e. last changed when?) air is being drawn in somewhere - the favourite being the T-piece on the filter and a dislodged or missing O ring or the filter might just be blocked/full of water.

 

2. If the clicking is the stop solenoid in the fuel pump, then look at the main power relay K198 on the 2nd level of the fuse box, sometimes known to give intermittent problems. (also known as relay 109 ??? I dont know for sure)

 

http://www.fordgalaxy.org.uk/ford/index.php?/topic/22772-the-oft-mentioned-relay-109-photos-included/?hl=%22relay+109%22

Edited March 21, 2013 by seatkid

[metaljim]

I have been thinking about the battery,does seem to turn over fast enough and does that for sometime before going flat, will get a drop test on it for piece of mind,bubbles have now gone,filter i change at about 8000 miles and since unscrewed the nut on the bottom nothing much came out of there,recently changed the T piece..i will have another go tomorrow, thanks!!

[seatkid]

unscrewed the nut on the bottom nothing much came out of there,recently changed the T piece..i will have another go tomorrow, thanks!!

 

nothing much as in you couldnt get any fuel out?

 

is the filter installed correctly? - not back to front? looking from the front towards the rear of the engine, the T piece should be on the left of the filter. When you changed the T-piece did you check it had an O ring fitted? (some versions have 2)

 

 

Edited March 21, 2013 by seatkid

[seatkid]

Obviously, if the filter is on the wrong way, dont attempt to turn it around but just bin and fit a new one.

[metaljim]

Filter was ok as i said further up the page, that i had driven thrity odd miles without any trouble,but did change the filter today just in case it had collected any muck in it,but still no joy, had the battery on charge for about 15 hours before trying to start it after fitting fuel filter,and did notice a difference with it turning over,it was not a steady contiuous turn over,sort of fast one minute and slower next with turn of the key,when trying to start the car now it does feel differant turning over,a bit slower than normal,put that down to the power being drawn to the glow plugs now, will be taking battery tomorrow to get it checked out,any dodgy cells out would make a diesel harder to start than a petrol i surpose...

[f0ster]

how old is it, if it has a bosch rotary pump then it will be the fuel running back, replace all of the return pipes on the injectors, 

[metaljim]

Thanks for the info,i will look tomorrow and see if it is a bosch,saying that are they the ones what they call the leak of pipes,if so i have changed them as well.

[seatkid]

Think you better look at that relay 109

[metaljim]

Will do that seatkid, i think i might have done the wrong thing here,i did changed that back at the end of  summer with a second hand one from a car breakers on ebay,when i was having trouble with limp mode, trying to save money again lol.

[seatkid]

Hope you kept the original relay then!

[metaljim]

Yeah, i will stick that one back in and see what happens.

[metaljim]

Well had the battery tested today and was told it was knackard, would have brought a new one but feel that my battery still turns engine over fast enough, and to buy one and still end up no go, will give the battery another charge,and then change the relay over and see what happens.  i surppose if battery is dodgy it can put things out, even if you feel it is turning engine over fast enough.